Transcript:
Nancy: If hiring feels confusing.
Tiffany: and job searching feels overwhelming
Nancy: you’re not imagining it,
Tiffany: and you’re definitely not alone.
Nancy: Welcome to Talent Unfiltered. I’m Nancy, and I’m here to ask the questions candidates and companies are actually thinking.
Tiffany: And I’m Tiffany Wallace, I’m the CEO of Dagen Personnel. I’ve spent years inside the hiring process and I’m here to break down what really happens behind the scenes for you openly, honestly and without any corporate filter.
Nancy: Why great candidates say no, why companies move slow, why interviews go sideways, and why job descriptions miss the mark.
Tiffany: And how both sides can do better.
Nancy: If you hire people.
Tiffany: Or you want to be hired?
Nancy: This show is for you.
Tiffany: Welcome to Talent Unfiltered. Unfiltered conversations for people who hire and for people who want to be hired.
Nancy: And today’s episode is one we know many people need right now. So, you lost your job, now what?
Nancy: Losing your job can feel like someone pulled the floor from under you. One minute you’re working, the next minute you’re staring at your future you didn’t plan for.
Tiffany: You know, but you this moment right here it’s not the end, it’s a restart. And, you know, you may feel like you’re the only person that this has ever happened to, but you’re not alone. We deal with this every day and take phone calls from people.
Tiffany: And so today we’re going to talk about what to do immediately after losing your job so that you can regain control, rebuild confidence, and start moving forward.
Nancy: Okay, so let’s start with the emotional side because job loss isn’t just logical, it’s personal.
Tiffany: Oh, absolutely. It hits your identity, your confidence, even down to your routine and the first thing that people need to hear is that your feelings are normal and validated.
Nancy: Okay, and so going into feelings, why does job loss feel like a personal failure even when it isn’t?
Tiffany: as many people as I’ve talked to over the years I think the reason it feels so personal is because you have invested so much of your life, not only with the people that you work with on a daily basis, but the projects, the company, the culture who you have even grown to become during the time that you’ve been there. So, when you’re let go, whether it’s through a riff or maybe even a mistake, then gosh, it’s hard not to take it personally.
Nancy: And why do you think that someone feels ashamed and wants to isolate after losing their job? And what would you tell those people to do?
Tiffany: Um, ignore what people think. I mean, I still have to tell myself that all the time. It doesn’t matter what anybody else thinks, but the shame is just part of the process. Once you go through it and you understand that it’s just part of the loss, you know, you’ll quickly get over it. There’s no shame to ever losing a job, ever.
Nancy: Okay. And then what does that mental freeze look like? And how can someone start to break out of it?
Tiffany: The mental freeze a lot of times can be where people just don’t know what to do with their day. They wake up and they stay in their robe all day, or they get up and they immediately start, you know, looking for something brand new. And when they haven’t even processed the feelings that they have. So, I say this all the time, Nancy, you know, you hear me say to the office, take a deep breath.
Nancy: you do
Nancy: okay, then once we’re out of that mental freeze and we’ve, like, taken control of our emotions, let’s talk about what to do immediately, not next week, not when you’re feeling ready, but right now. So, what should people look for right away and their severance or benefits or unemployment options, so they don’t miss something important.
Tiffany: Yeah, well, I mean, unless you have been fired or terminated cause for something, you know, pretty egregious, then you should immediately file for unemployment.
Tiffany: Unemployment is there for you, and so we have contractors that had been with us for a long time or even employees. And, and you need to file for unemployment. It’s your money.
Tiffany: The second thing is make sure that any benefits that you have, like cobra. I mean, if you really have to make sure that you have insurance for your family, check in with your HR team about that.
Tiffany: And then any other kind of paperwork that they may have had you sign. You might even want to have an attorney look over it.
Nancy: Okay, and then how can someone exit a job, and you know, it goes especially under stress without burning bridges or damaging for future opportunities.
Tiffany: Um, oh, people call me and ask, hey, listen, you know, I think I’m gonna be reduced, or I think that our organization is struggling, and I might lose my job. What do you think? And what if it happens? And that with a single thing I tell everybody is shut your mouth, because you’re so emotional.
Nancy: That’s true
Tiffany: and, or angry or surprised that there are things that you’ll say in that moment that you may come back to later and wish that you never did. So, the best thing you can say is, thank you, I understand. Or if you can’t muster out thank you, if you can just at least say I understand. And then you can always come back to it later and email or with a phone call with someone, but don’t regret what you say in the moment.
Nancy: Okay, so keep calm.
Tiffany: Yes, oh gosh. If you can, it’s very emotional even if you cry, cry, but try to keep your mouth shut, so you don’t have to worry about it later.
Nancy: I’ll probably just cry.
Tiffany: Yeah, I cry. I’m a crier.
Nancy: Me too, Okay, so the job search reality check, here’s the truth people don’t always want to hear. Finding a job right now takes about eight to twelve weeks, sometimes longer depending on your field.
Tiffany: Knowing that timeline up front really helps people plan emotionally and financially. And, and there’s two parts to that.
Tiffany: You have a college graduate that, you know, has graduated from college and boy, they think they’re just gonna come out hit the ground running. And a year later they’re calling me and saying, what am I doing?
Tiffany: What is the problem? Um, sometimes and especially in this market, it’s just taking a little bit longer for someone who’s already in a career. And depending on what level you’re at or the job you’re seeking, it is a minimum of eight to twelve weeks.
Tiffany: So you can take your foot off your neck, you know, you can quit feeling any kind of shame you have about the fact that you didn’t get a job in two weeks. I mean, that’s almost comical,
Nancy: but, okay, I’m gonna put this out there because I was employed and searching and it took me about eight to twelve weeks. So, this is true.
Tiffany: very true.
Nancy: Okay, so I have some questions for you.
Tiffany: okay,
Tiffany: Okay, why are hiring cycles so slow right now? And what’s actually happening behind the scenes during those weeks of silence?
Tiffany: You know, so I’m going to answer that a little bit differently than, you know um, giving a bunch of answers that I don’t have answers too. I think that during the hiring process and during the interviewing process, those are questions that you need to ask, you need to ask, how long has the job been open? Um, how many other candidates have you interviewed?
Tiffany: When would you like this position filled? Or, you know, when would you like someone to be in this position?
Tiffany: And then also, you know, what is your game plan or the when the first, when the person starts, what would you like them to accomplish first, and how quickly. that is already going to answer some of those questions later on If you haven’t heard from them,
Nancy: okay
Tiffany: If they can’t answer any of those in the interview. Red flags
Nancy: red flags, those are real
Tiffany: their real
Nancy: even in jobs and dating.
Nancy: Okay, all right
Tiffany: when someone replies
Nancy: me too.
Tiffany: Now though, now you know, twelve years of Virgil, I don’t have any red flags. Nancy: That’s good to hear. He’s gonna be glad to hear that too.
Tiffany: That’s right.
Tiffany: Okay, when someone doesn’t hear back for a while, what is the delay? Usually, it’s not a sign of anything that’s going wrong in their application?
Tiffany: I don’t think so. I think it really just depends on what’s happening internally in the company, and that goes back to you asking the right questions in the interviews about the job that you’re interviewing for.
Nancy: Okay, and then how can people pace their energy over an eight to twelve week job search, so they don’t burn out halfway through?
Tiffany: Oh goodness, you know, I eat a lot of ice cream
Nancy: cause I was burning out.
Tiffany: under stress
Nancy: while employed, but go ahead.
Tiffany: Oh gosh, that’s so true. The burnout while you’re employed, looking for another job is equally as hard as the burnout without a job when you’re looking.
Tiffany: Um, I can say that most people that I talk to end up getting into some kind of exercise program, you know, get your endorphins going, and then at least do something positive for yourself every day. Um you know, I mean, I’m trying to drink less diet coke, but I do something for myself every day that makes me happy.
Nancy: I’m not gonna say what you told me not to say,
Tiffany: Um
Nancy: uh about the diet coke.
Tiffany: but oh, please, shh
Nancy: okay, I’m gonna, shh, okay, but let’s talk about the non-negotiables, right, um, and I’ve heard you talk about this a lot -LinkedIn. Let’s be blunt, if you’re not on LinkedIn, you’re invisible.
Tiffany: recruiters live there, opportunities live there, and your network lives there. This isn’t your Facebook or your Instagram or, you know TikTok. LinkedIn, If you’ve been in a job for the last ten to twenty years and you come out of it and you don’t have a LinkedIn profile, you need to do it immediately. You need to have a professional picture on the LinkedIn profile, and your resume needs to match it.
Tiffany: But the importance of that, some older, not older mature candidates and I’ll just use my dad for an example, you know, when he finally left a job, he didn’t know what LinkedIn was and when I told him, he was like, that’s just letting people into my personal business and it’s really not, it’s about marketing yourself.
Nancy: Okay, and so for someone who’s been avoiding LinkedIn, what are the absolute must have elements of a basic profile that make you visible to recruiters?
Tiffany: Absolutely you need to have your profile picture on LinkedIn. You should have at least a, um, picture of yourself, you know, body shot. I’ve seen some pictures where people even have a picture with their dog. I’m okay with that.
Tiffany: I don’t think that you should have a picture of yourself, you know, playing tennis, but it just depends on what you like and what you’re going for. It all depends on the kind of job you’re seeking, and then people want to have an idea of who you are before they come in.
Nancy: Okay
Tiffany: Everyone is looking at your picture
Nancy: and then I also heard you talking, uh, to a candidate called you earlier this morning actually, and you mentioned that her resume didn’t match her LinkedIn and I think that’s a basic element, right?
Tiffany: That’s true, yes, we have clients now that if their resume does not match their LinkedIn profile, they will say that it’s because of a lack of attention to detail and then they will not interview them.
Tiffany: So, whenever we have a candidate that we are, um, recruiting or have recruited and then we’re representing, we make sure that their LinkedIn profile matches their resume, and we go over the importance of that and why it needs to happen.
Nancy: Okay, and then another question that I want to ask you. Why does simply being active on LinkedIn matter so much? And what does activity actually look like for someone who’s just getting started?
Tiffany: Well, if it’s for specific industry, and, you know that I think that some employers would like to see how involved you are with what’s going on.
Tiffany: Um, I don’t think that you have to get on there every day and make a comment or, you know um, spend a lot of time doing it because we’re all busy with other lives. But you at least acknowledging a post or reposting something shows the algorithm that you are interested in.
Tiffany: What that is, and that could possibly lead to a job opportunity for you. So, you need to make sure that whatever you’re posting on LinkedIn is something that is gonna move you forward and not backward.
Nancy: Okay, now, I’ve also heard you mention, you know, make connections.
Tiffany: oh, make connections. all the college kids that come out now on, if they are a supply chain grad, or they’re an accountant or as a finance major or engineer.
Tiffany: I always tell them, you know, get on LinkedIn minimum of ten a day, start linking in with people in the profession that you wanna be in.
Tiffany: In fact, if you see a job on LinkedIn, find one of the engineering directors, send him a personal message in LinkedIn and say, hey, I just graduated from, you know, whatever university.
Tiffany: I’ll say Baylor University, cause that’s where I went “sick em.” Anyway, I, you know, they might have graduated from any university, and then they just need to be able to, um, say I graduated, and do you have any job openings you need to market yourself.
Nancy: Okay, all right, now we’re gonna talk about gathering references and why that’s so important.
Tiffany: Sure
Nancy: okay, so references, this is the big one, and I think people forget and that their last minute searching for references, right.
Tiffany: Yes, and I’m a big believer in references. I think one of the, um, key elements for us with our job and recruiting is to be able to back a candidate with a reference from a former manager or employer that we can then say, this is how, you know, with, this is how great they were. It’s actually somebody else talking for them.
Nancy: Okay. And I have some questions that I wanted to see if you could answer those for the audience that’s listening today. When someone is suddenly job searching, who are the best types of people to ask for references and who should they avoid?
Tiffany: I definitely should find a supervisor that they’ve had in the past. Now they don’t have it from their current role, obviously, okay, but you need to have someone in the past that you’ve worked for.
Tiffany: That would give you a good reference. Nowadays, companies, um you know, don’t feel like it’s legal to allow someone to speak about you because of all the defamation cases that can be coming out. They only do your dates of employment and, um you know, are you rehireable
Tiffany: now, I think that’s very interesting because that’s a legal question to answer. That’s another reason why whenever you let go or in a reduction, enforce that you be very quiet on your way out, so they don’t decide after the fact that you’re not rehireable.
Nancy: That’s true. Okay, and then what’s the most effective and respectful way to ask someone for a reference so doesn’t kind of feel uncomfortable or last minute, you know, especially for the shy people out there?
Tiffany: Well, that’s true. You know I mean, but it depends on the relationship that you’ve had with the person and really depends on how strong of a worker you were. That is always a phone call. It’s never an email; it’s never a text message. It’s always a phone call and it’s the way you convey the ask.
Nancy: Okay, and then why is it so important to gather references early in the process instead of waiting for those final interviews?
Tiffany: Well, you’ve heard me say that, you know, two words red flag a couple of times, and I’ll tell you why. So, you know, a company comes to you and says, hey, we really love you, we’re ready to possibly make an offer, but we need to check your references and your responses.
Tiffany: Oh, let me get those. You’re not prepared, you’re not organized, and you weren’t ready to receive an offer from that client. Those are all three red flags when you don’t have your references ready. So I would make sure that by the time you begin interviewing, you have people that will talk about you.
Nancy: Okay, guys, have your references ready!
Tiffany: right.
Nancy: Okay, so under our next talking point, here’s the part people underestimate, right, your next job is probably going to be, is probably gonna come from someone you already know.
Tiffany: well, even the people you think you don’t know anyone you do, you know, a lot of people, you just never had to reach out to them until now.
Nancy: Okay, exactly. and so, when someone is starting a job search, who are the first people you recommend? They reach out to old coworkers, classmates, former managers, and why those people specifically?
Tiffany: Well, I’m, you know, I’m a believer in faith, right? And I believe that god connects dots for us, but it is, it’s the old coworkers because they could be at a new, location, and they could have an opening that, you know, that you’re not aware of or that the company hasn’t posted on LinkedIn. It could be an old classmate that’s working somewhere or even a manager. You know, that’s why relationships are so important.
Tiffany: That’s why it’s so important whenever you do leave to be quiet and or, you know, to stay in touch with people and remember the little things.
Nancy: Okay, but then a lot of people feel awkward reconnecting after, after a long time. What’s a natural low-pressure way to restart those conversations
Tiffany: LinkedIn. I mean, as I say,
Nancy: we’re looping back to LinkedIn guys.
Tiffany: Yes, LinkedIn. I mean, it’s an easy way to reach out to somebody, and say, hey, I’ve lost my job, and do you happen to have any openings within your company? and I would love to reconnect.
Nancy: Okay, and then why do weak ties. People you barely know or haven’t talked to in years often end up being the strongest leads in your job search? Why do you think that is?
Tiffany: You know, I don’t sometimes those people have an opinion of you that, that you never knew they had. and, um, it’s important that you just go back to the people that are in your life and reach out to them, and see what happens. You know, let, let karma take care of itself. You probably have a lot more karma stored up than what you think.
Nancy: Oh, I love that.
Nancy: Okay, so let’s give people a simple checklist that they can start today.
Tiffany: Okay, here it is, I mean, let me just surprise you with update your LinkedIn
Nancy: oh, we knew that was going to come, because you LinkedIn, LinkedIn, LinkedIn. Guys!
Tiffany: I mean, I say it all day every day to people that call and I talk to, for sure, and if you don’t know how to do that then you can call us at Dagen and we’ll review it with you and we’ll help you put on there what you need.
Tiffany: You know, I’d write a short kind of you know, what people call an elevator speech, you know, where you’re exploring new opportunities and why. Don’t you be caught off guard where you’re just like, well, I don’t even really know what I’m going to do. Red flag. That means you don’t have any ambition or confidence to move forward. It’s hard to overcome the being let go, but you’ve got to go ahead and move forward. and so, then you can gather your references, big deal.
Tiffany: We just talked about that. Uh, I would make a weekly job search schedule, but even beyond that, I want you to write down every place that you have applied.
Tiffany: There is nothing more disappointing than to call somebody who you think is an excellent candidate and they say, now where are you calling from or what job are you calling about? Well, that means that candidate really didn’t even care enough to know that they applied to that job. And for a recruiter or hiring manager, again, that’s a red flag.
Tiffany: So make sure you’re tracking what you’re doing and then add exercise into your routine that like I said again, the endorphins are really what are gonna kind of be able to keep you, you know, ahead of the game.
Tiffany: I would start a gratitude list every day, get up and be glad about what you currently have, you know, or you’re grateful for your, for your wife, or your husband, or your kids, or your dog. I mean, anything that you can be grateful for.
Nancy: I think that’s going to keep us motivated, right?
Tiffany: Oh my gosh, Yes, absolutely. And then set one small goal, look at a day you know, we laughed a little bit earlier. My goal today was not to drink more than three diet cokes. And yeah, I did, I missed the goal.
Nancy: You did?
Tiffany: Yeah, that’s my fourth.
Nancy: Um, no, ma’am.
Nancy: Okay, guys
Tiffany: Awful
Nancy: so lets just, so let’s just keep in mind that after you created this checklist, you’re not starting over. You’re starting fresh.
Tiffany: Absolutely and this chapter might lead you somewhere better than where you are. So, keep the faith. Make sure that you’re ready for your next move.
Nancy: Okay,
Tiffany: If you’re listening to this and you’re really in the middle of it, I want you to take a deep breath.
Tiffany: This is not the end of your story; it might just be the end of the chapter. You’ve probably heard that before. This is your book, the end of a chapter, and you’re gonna move on to the next.
Nancy: and we’re here to help you every step of the way. Thanks for joining us on this episode. So, you lost your job now what? Stay tuned for our next episode and follow Talent Unfiltered.
Tiffany: Have a great weekend.
Nancy: Ciao